Run Etiquette

[Clam Gun]

I would like to know everyone's opinion about run etiquette. I live on a popular run on the Clackamas River (I know boo hoo) and I often show up and there are already folks fishing. I am able to fish both sides of the river as I have a little pack raft and I can blow it up and zip across in a few min. Several times I have showed up and have either been told "we have the run for the day" or "I already fished through, my friend is going to fish through, and then I am going to fish through and then you can fish through after that" (lol) or the best one was when Dustin Chromers and I ferried across in my canoe and we were paid a visit by the one and only Jeff Hickman who told us we were messing with his program and we could have the run in the evening but he needed to fish it in the morning with his clients.
So what do you all think? Should I ask to be the next angler through the run or do I need to call the clubhouse for a tee-time?

 

[Yard Sale]

This is why they invented zippered waders.(Hint: it's not to pee)

Personally I'd say:
If somebody is in a run they have rights.
If somebody is waiting at the top to get in a run they have next. BUT, they need to put in a reasonable distance from the guy in front of them(45 min rule?)
Nobody owns a run for a day. If you fish a run then you go to the back of the line.
Guides get no preference. If anything they get less. Especially guides in jet boats.
Also, home owners get no preference on public legally accessed water.

All that said, this is why I either put in late or fish weird spots with little buckets. Drama just ruins it for me.

 

[Pink Nighty]

When I get to a run that is occupied, I usually try to leave. I want solitude as much as anything else, and being alone in a run makes me feel more confident in finding a fish.

That said, if for whatever reason I'm not going to leave the run, I'll make contact politely and ask to fish above them. If they are in the head of the run, I'll ask them if they're working down and if not, where they would be comfortable with me starting.

The other day I pulled into a run and was taking my time getting ready. I planned to fish this rather large run for most of my day. Another guy pulled up, also fly fishing and started getting ready. I did beat him to the trailhead, but we talked and I told him that I'm planning on fishing this run all day, and if he had a specific part he wanted to target he could have it first and to just let me know. He was grateful, had a little seam he wanted to hit and be out in an hour. He hit it, we fished hundreds of yards apart and everyone was happy.

I feel like it pays to be kind, I've only had one asshat interaction over the years about who had dibs on the water.

 

[Divad]

Sometimes, as in your case, accessing another run is not exactly possible. I always ask them if they’re stepping or stagnant. If stepping I don’t mind waiting to get in behind them, if stagnant and there’s room below I’ll walk.

If they’re still a holes I tell them I’m terminally ill, and if all else fails a Line Cutter Muddler is in order. Been meaning to tie some of those. If you can’t share the river gtfo and go sit on your thumb, respectively.

 

[Pink Nighty]

Sometimes, as in your case, accessing another run is not exactly possible. I always ask them if they’re stepping or stagnant. If stepping I don’t mind waiting to get in behind them, if stagnant and there’s room below I’ll walk.

If they’re still a holes I tell them I’m terminally ill, and if all else fails a Line Cutter Muddler is in order. Been meaning to tie some of those. If you can’t share the river gtfo and go sit on your thumb, respectively.

I'll bite, what's a line cutter muddler?

 

[flybill]

If I see more than a few people, I'll probably move on to a different spot. To deal with floaters, or guides, start where they will take out or a bit higher than that. Near the end of the day, move up to where they put in..

Sounds like you just ran into some people who are thinking wrong.. I would step in above the highest guy and work down behind them.. or in the specific case you mentioned just move to a different spot... and be tempted to let the air out of their tires.. okay, no not really..

Life's to short to put up with that stuff and hopefully karma will pay them back in the end!

 

[Divad]

I'll bite, what's a line cutter muddler?

A Muddler Minnow with one of these cut out (red line) and placed under the head of the hook. Line cutter *cough* I mean a glorified weed guard. An old tippet spool with the cutter part cut off would work too.

I spoke with a guy at church who used razor blades instead but with my luck I’d end up catching a fish and doing more harm.

Yank hard and then quickly add an “oh good they untangled”

 

[DKL]

I personally let shit like this bother me too much. I fish to enjoy myself and relax and I’m the kind of person that struggles to not let this kind of stuff get under my skin. If a guide came up to me as I was about to fish and basically tell me not to because he was going to later, I think I’d tell him he’s more than welcome to follow me through, find another run to fish or go f himself. But I think my immediate reaction would be either to laugh or just look startled with disbelief that someone has the nerve to imply they have some sort of priority or ownership.

 

[Rob Allen]

I would like to know everyone's opinion about run etiquette. I live on a popular run on the Clackamas River (I know boo hoo) and I often show up and there are already folks fishing. I am able to fish both sides of the river as I have a little pack raft and I can blow it up and zip across in a few min. Several times I have showed up and have either been told "we have the run for the day" or "I already fished through, my friend is going to fish through, and then I am going to fish through and then you can fish through after that" (lol) or the best one was when Dustin Chromers and I ferried across in my canoe and we were paid a visit by the one and only Jeff Hickman who told us we were messing with his program and we could have the run in the evening but he needed to fish it in the morning with his clients.
So what do you all think? Should I ask to be the next angler through the run or do I need to call the clubhouse for a tee-time?

It's simple and it's not opinion.
First one to the run gets to fish the run first.
If someone is there when you arrive you can start at the top of the run and fish behind then without their permission..
If you can cross the river and fish different water than they are fishing you can do so without permission. However if your casting to the same water as them, then again only fish behind them.

There is no distance at which it ok to go below another angler, no matter how crowded the river is. Is a run is a mile long the first angler there gets first dibs at the whole thing.. it is not ok to go in below them. If you ask to go in bellow someone go at least 400 yards below them, yes give them a quarter mile that is in no way excessive.

If you get their first the run from where you are downstream is yours. The river above you belongs to whoever shows up next.
You can fish as slow as you want until another angler shows up, at which time you become obligated to share the run by casting and stepping your way down the run.(even if you are nymphing) you don't get to camp in one spot ) that's being an jerk.
When you get to the bottom you are free to walk back to the top and fish it again behind any other anglers who showed up.

Any guide who's program is to fish one run all morning rotating anglers through it multiple times is guiding a river not worth his clients money to fish in my opinion.

I personally cannot imagine paying money to fish the Clackamas but that's just me..

These have been the rules for sharing the water for decades. It's all very common sense..

 

[clarkman]

There are many reasons that when I fish for steelhead (which is pretty rare these days) that it's on waters that aren't all that busy because they're super out of the way.....shoot, even while trout fishing recently I had someone ask me if they could pop in above me (I was fishing up, had already fished that area though, so I let them)....but, we were the only two groups on ~2.5 miles of river...

Nice that you can just pop across to the other side though.

 

[DoesItFloat]

You get in there after they go through and pick their pockets, boy! In all seriousness, if you LIVE on the run, then you should have no trouble spending lots of time there. If you really want to go through it first, you probably have the best chance of setting up before anyone else gets to it, and you probably have the best shot at last light. Other than that, you should treat it like any other run on an urban, busy steelhead river.

 

[Yard Sale]

It's simple and it's not opinion.
First one to the run gets to fish the run first.
If someone is there when you arrive you can start at the top of the run and fish behind then without their permission..
If you can cross the river and fish different water than they are fishing you can do so without permission. However if your casting to the same water as them, then again only fish behind them.

There is no distance at which it ok to go below another angler, no matter how crowded the river is. Is a run is a mile long the first angler there gets first dibs at the whole thing.. it is not ok to go in below them. If you ask to go in bellow someone go at least 400 yards below them, yes give them a quarter mile that is in no way excessive.

If you get their first the run from where you are downstream is yours. The river above you belongs to whoever shows up next.
You can fish as slow as you want until another angler shows up, at which time you become obligated to share the run by casting and stepping your way down the run.(even if you are nymphing) you don't get to camp in one spot ) that's being an jerk.
When you get to the bottom you are free to walk back to the top and fish it again behind any other anglers who showed up.

Any guide who's program is to fish one run all morning rotating anglers through it multiple times is guiding a river not worth his clients money to fish in my opinion.

I personally cannot imagine paying money to fish the Clackamas but that's just me..

These have been the rules for sharing the water for decades. It's all very common sense..

Agreed, with one question. What defines a run?

I'm thinking specifically of Pipeline, the run just above Macks on the D. Its basically a mile long run that kinda has 3 kick points, which have matching pull outs. There isn't any white water "heads" nor any real tailouts. Just slight shifts in the run.

I tend to call that three separate fishing spots, and thus if somebody is at the top of one you can drop into the top of another below them. No way could somebody fish the entire thing before the sun gets on the water. One section at best.

 

[mcswny]

This is why I don’t fish for steelhead.

 

[Grandpa Jim]

I try to minimize the possibility of encounters with other anglers in rivers. I'm more of a solitary angler, anyway.

For OP steelhead I deliberately fish spots that take some walking or are a pain to get to, for both gear and fly. That eliminates much of my bank competition. If I see a vehicle parked at the trailhead I'll not get out of my car unless there are multiple spots I can fish from the trail. If that access trail has only one run to fish I move on to the next closest "milk run" spot of mine. For areas with boat traffic I'll time it early or late depending on boat launch sites. If there is a boat in the run that I walk into then I'll start fishing above them (after 1st observing how and with what they are fishing...and then doing something different). If the boat is at the top of the run I tell them I'll fish behind them. If they tell me, or I get the impression that they are going to camp out then I'll just leave. Often times the guys in that boat will then see me 30 minutes later fishing the next good run down river that they want to fish...

Now for the anglers that walk in on my run and low hole me...I may give them a questioning look but it's just not worth it to me to get into an argument. I make the best of the situation with my fishing...you never know. Case in point: Several years ago I was swinging the top of a run with my Spey. A gear guy walked out of the woods at the tailout and proceeded to walk up to the head. He stopped about 30' below me, turned around, and then started meticulously fishing the water with bobber/jig/pink worm. I had to pull in all my running line and still didn't have enough space to cast my head and tip to swing my fly. I waited him out until he fished that section of river close to far, then moved down. I then proceeded to follow him down the run in kind of a herky/jerky manner. He never looked back to see where I was or to make eye contact. By his casting and mending ability he was an experienced angler so I made note of how and where he fished the run for my own gear float fishing edification. He fished the whole run without a grab, then walked out. Meanwhile on my last cast, on the hang down and 3' off the shore in the tail out I hooked a big honker! It thrashed and went back and forth at the tail out. At the same time a fly guide across the river floating by in a raft with 2 bobber chuckers saw it happen and pulled up to watch and give me space with the fish. After a couple minutes the fish just hunkered down and I couldn't budge it. I moved my rod under tension back and forth to try to get it off the spot but that didn't work. Out of desperation I shoved my rod tip deep into the water and put heavy pressure on....and then slowly some of the tension reduced and I could sense that it was moving up river. I slowly reeled in. I got a brief glimpse of a big chromer 20' away from me with my line moving up river. As the fish went by I pivoted and moved my rod up and then horizontal to the my other side...then the fish shook off.

A bummer, but justice in a sense for me putting up with the low holer by waiting him out while continuing my fishing. I always try to remember that experience whenever I run into the occasional "rude" angler or boat party on the OP.

 

[SurfnFish]

there's more than one kind of etiquette...decade back was fishing one of my most reliable winter runs on the coast, had a bump on the swing I couldn't convert, got out of the water, walked back upriver, changed flies and was about to get back in the water to give it another go when a guide friend (fellow surfer) came drifting around the bend with an older couple in front of his 18' Willie...back rowed alongside the bank while we exchanged greetings...first time the couple had fished steelhead, husband had always wanted to, they were halfway through their drift without a bump...told my friend where I had gotten bumped, he was welcome to set up on it...and tag a nice fish they did, husband whooping an hollering as he fought it to the net, where it was released after photos..for me it would have been another fun battle, for the husband it was a bucket list experience...and for my guide friend who I saw a few days later at the beach, it was the only fish they caught on the drift, and he could not have been more thankful for the assist.
We know we've caught enough fish when we don't mind not catching one so someone else can...

 

[PhilR]

Sounds like Hickman.

 

[O' Clarkii Stomias]

I've found the Golden Rule, "Do unto others as you would have them do unto you" works pretty good.
If the river is busy expect to share a run, if not, go somewhere else.
As far as being "low holed", the transgressor either knows what they've done, or is oblivious to an unwritten rule. Over the years, engagement of such is a waste of time and emotion.
If someone is parked below or "half stepping", expect me to go around, while providing ample spacing.
Upon hooking a fish, heed enough space to allow the angler to land the fish unimpeded. I don't expect, nor feel the need to abandon a spot in line after landing a fish. It's up to the individual whether or not to go to the top of the run after such.
I don't do the Dawn Patrol stuff much anymore unless it's camp water. I've found some coffee and a bite to eat lends itself to a better day on the water than fumble fucking around in the dark.

 

[SKYKO]

Agreed, with one question. What defines a run?

I'm thinking specifically of Pipeline, the run just above Macks on the D. Its basically a mile long run that kinda has 3 kick points, which have matching pull outs. There isn't any white water "heads" nor any real tailouts. Just slight shifts in the run.

I tend to call that three separate fishing spots, and thus if somebody is at the top of one you can drop into the top of another below them. No way could somebody fish the entire thing before the sun gets on the water. One section at best.

I agree and in fact have Lowholed you personally in the pipeline as you were starting right as the sun went behind the ridge at the midpoint which I call pyramid rock and I deliberately took the very bottom cove and tailout at the end of the pipeline. During peak season all 3 or 4 access points to this stretch are continually utilized by different anglers from dawn to dusk.

The exact same principle applies to the other side via access by boat from powder puff to the bottom, just the way it is.

 

[_WW_]

I have found that no matter what you do it's bound to piss off some one.
Read the room is the best advice I can give.

 

[Stonedfish]

Being accused of low holing or being low holed by someone isn’t confined to just rivers or streams.
SF