Gearing up, backing and line ?s

[headduck]

So...gearing up and learning things and almost there.

Got a lamson remix 7+ 3 pack on sale ($180) and intend to throw 7/8 wt ines. I'll mount it on a reddington torrent 7 wt, also on sale ($99)... I understand I'm kinda on the low end here but cant yet justify the super expensive stuff.

Also found a vintage bronson multi 380 matched to a mcgill 7wt glass rod. Refurbed the reel, spins like a top.

Between the 2 setups I will be working through the initial learning curves.

Will be fishing primarily w wa rivers and beaches.

As you can see from above, my budget is limited as I learn.

Now the questions.

Backing and lines?

What make sense from a value standpoint. Not the cheapest, nor the best, but decent product for good dollar that is somewhat forgiving to the myriad of mistakes that are certainly forthcoming?

For backing...
I have read folks rec larger braid (power pro etc) as an affordable backer (which I have a couple spools of). Aside from fears of losing digits, any other problems?
I also see folks say backing hasn't been seen since it was spooled, so is this moot on w wa rivers?
Dacron seems to deteriorate over time, but is that even relevant?

What should I not do? Maybe that will find a consensus more easily?

As far as lines:
Intending to spool full float, tip sink, full sink on respective spools. The bronson, not sure yet.
Are there any line brands to avoid?
Would spending an extra x$ make a big difference in performance?
What can get me though beginner stage and still be useful beyond?
I'd preference catchabilty to castabilty if that makes...barely does to me.

TLDR: what backing and why? What's a good value line for a beginner and still allow growth?

 

[Matt B]

So...gearing up and learning things and almost there.

Got a lamson remix 7+ 3 pack on sale ($180) and intend to throw 7/8 wt ines. I'll mount it on a reddington torrent 7 wt, also on sale ($99)... I understand I'm kinda on the low end here but cant yet justify the super expensive stuff.

Also found a vintage bronson multi 380 matched to a mcgill 7wt glass rod. Refurbed the reel, spins like a top.

Between the 2 setups I will be working through the initial learning curves.

Will be fishing primarily w wa rivers and beaches.

As you can see from above, my budget is limited as I learn.

Now the questions.

Backing and lines?

What make sense from a value standpoint. Not the cheapest, nor the best, but decent product for good dollar that is somewhat forgiving to the myriad of mistakes that are certainly forthcoming?

For backing...
I have read folks rec larger braid (power pro etc) as an affordable backer (which I have a couple spools of). Aside from fears of losing digits, any other problems?
I also see folks say backing hasn't been seen since it was spooled, so is this moot on w wa rivers?
Dacron seems to deteriorate over time, but is that even relevant?

What should I not do? Maybe that will find a consensus more easily?

As far as lines:
Intending to spool full float, tip sink, full sink on respective spools. The bronson, not sure yet.
Are there any line brands to avoid?
Would spending an extra x$ make a big difference in performance?
What can get me though beginner stage and still be useful beyond?
I'd preference catchabilty to castabilty if that makes...barely does to me.

TLDR: what backing and why? What's a good value line for a beginner and still allow growth?

Lotta good questions. I think your rod and reel setups sound great will serve you well for quite a while. As you figure things out you will likely want to add to that pair of rods--potentially a lighter weight rod like a 4 or 5 weight for trout fishing. Not that you can't trout fish with a 7 weight, it's just that it can be a little more difficult getting a soft presentation with tiny flies from the bigger line that is used for a heavier weight rod, not impossible, just a bit different. But that's not even what you asked about.

For backing, I think I have dacron on pretty much every reel except my "big game" ocean bluewater setups where I want the extra backing length/volume of braid in case I hook something truly huge and powerful. I suppose dacron may degrade eventually if you abuse (let it mildew/rot or keep it in the sun) it but I haven't found that point yet. It should last a long time. 30 lb. is commonly used but anything from 20-50 should work fine.

As to lines- That's a lot more complicated. Here is where it may pay off, in my experience, not to cheap out too much and to "buy once, cry once." Except lines don't last forever and do degrade with use, to varying extents. For recommendations, it would really help to know what kind of river and beach fishing you want to do, but since you have two setups, if you want to concentrate more on beaches vs. rivers, I'd recommend one full floater, and one full fast intermediate (like a type 2 sink). If you want to concentrate on rivers more than beaches, I'd go one full floater and one sink tip.

When I was figuring more things out I had a RIO versitip system and used it quite a bit. It was okay for lots of thing but not great for any one thing. It helped me figure out what I needed and liked and what worked for me though. They are kind of expensive now and a lot of people have had some durability issues with RIO line coatings (although reportedly their warranty dept is responsive). There are other makers of these, like OPST Commando. But TBH, I can't remember the last time I used the versitip. The loop-to-loop connection going through the line guides all the time on a single hand rod is less than ideal, for me. I still use the 15' sink tips from time to time however. Lately, I have been happy with lines from Scientific Anglers, Wulff, and Cortland. If you're looking for bargains on lines, you can sometimes find top quality lines as discounted new old stock. They're still good, just not the hot marketing. Sometimes you can get a good used line in the Classifieds but my experience with that has been mixed. The good part of that is even if you don't like the line, which happens, because you don't really know until you actually fish with it, at least then you're not out full price, which nowadays is no small matter for lines.

 

[rattlesnake]

Your gear is plenty good enough to start.

Buy some good lines - I’m partial to SA and airflo. I’d suggest going to your local shop to see if you can test some different lines on that rod. If you buy 2 lines or so, ask if they will spend some time giving you a free casting lesson (good shops don’t mind helping some especially if you can go in during the work day and they aren’t super busy, even 10 minutes of pointers is helpful

Definitely get a floating line. More than likely this will be your primary line at least for a while. You can work your way into some sinking lines or sink tip lines but I’d say see where you are fishing and how you are fishing to determine sink rate and style desired. Also are you wading or floating cause that may alter your perspective on which line to choose. Ask the people at the shop what they would use for a line for the area, technique and species you are considering - you don’t have to buy that line that day either but keep that thought in your head while fishing.

Going fishing and getting that experience is very important so if it’s a trade off, go fishing more than buying gear. And have fun!

 

[ARecher]

Probably not all that helpful since we're pretty much in the same boat. I might be a few weeks ahead of you. For line, I ended up buying and SA "AirCel" floater for yard practice (it was around $20 on sale). I have a 6 wt rod (fairly fast) and think I maybe should have gone with a 7wt line. I also have an SA Titan intermediate that I haven't cast yet. I expect that to be one of my actual fishing lines and didn't want to mess it up in the grass. It's also listed as a 6 wt but is about 40 grains heavier. SA also makes a WetCel that is fairly inexpensive with different sink rates that might be a good first line. Again, grain of salt here, I have almost no experience other than research. Getting ready to do it all over again with an 8wt setup pretty soon so I look forward to other responses from those who do know. Also, casting is hard!

 

[headduck]

Thanks yall.

Honestly, not sure how I'll be fishing but... I wont be floating the rivers yet...Will be wading.

Nearby rivers (sol duc, quil, bogie, dungie, +) have runs of kings, silvers, steelhead and more I'm sure. (Still learning about opportunities).

Also assume chasing src in nearby coastal waters, as well as beach casting for salmon when the time arises.

I'll spend some more time with the guys at the shop in PA. Good suggestion.

Fully agree that nothing can supplant the hours on the river with rod in hand. Itching to begin that process.

Truthfully, the challenge of it all is what is attractive.

 

[Salmo_g]

Fly line backing isn't cheap, but it's not terribly expensive either. I think the best route to go is to buy a bulk spool of 300, 600, or 1,200 yards. That will fill lots of reel spools, and it lasts just about forever. I have 40 year old dacron backing on several reels and feel no need to replace it. Just store it in a dark dry place like a closet or drawer.

Is that Bronson a multiplier? I have two old Bronson 370 reels. Perfectly good for trout and panfish, totally unsuited for steelhead and salmon. Ask me how I know. Is the W&M glass rod a yellow or orangish "Denco" model. I had one of those, a 7 wt. I fished for and caught trout from 6" to steelhead up to 14 pounds. If that's what you have, it's a serviceable rod, but you'll likely want a 5 wt graphite at some point if you're going to do a lot of trout fishing.

Cheap rods and cheap reels are mostly just fine, although there are plenty of dogs in the rod marketplace, especially at the lower price points. So you have to be careful. Cheap fly lines are nearly invariably a poor idea. The absolute best value fly line I know of is the Cortland 444 (peach in floating versions). I've been using them for nearly 50 years and just bought two more last year.

 

[ARecher]

Also, just a thought, not sure where you are from or if you are new to the area, but it might be a good idea to start familiarizing yourself with the WDFW regulations. Fishing a river or other body of water "out of season" can become a pretty expensive lesson. Barbless hooks, etc. etc. etc.

 

[Buzzy]

Great info from Matt, the snake and SG. Like SG, I too am a fan of Cortland 444 lines (they were the major line supplier when I started FF'ing). Dacron lasts forever, if taken care of. I'd be scouting for a 5 weight for trout.

Sequim, huh! Go Wolves.

 

[headduck]

The bronson is a multi, but also have a single action 306 in it's original box sold for $3.95. I could see a silver or any larger fish detroying the multi. The W&M is more more a darker orange and super soft. Denco, I assumed that was a brand name but it's the blank material? Thanks for the schoolin.

I have 5-6 other rods from gpa that I'll start to use when I get a bit better. Dont want to ruin sentimental items. Although I'm not sure if they're worth babying or or even using.

Will look at larger backing spools and the cortland lines.

I know a bit about the fluidity of regs here... I've met our game warden a few times. She can often be found overlooking the hole with binoculars. She doesn't mess around and is quick with the pen. Especially if a few well know "flossers" are present.

I'll be on the hunt for a 5wt. My cousin used to guide in Bzmn MT and did time at a local fly shop there. If I can wait til i see him, he's got a little sumthin for me...as well as couple holes to show off. The waiting is the hardest part.

Yup Sequim. For me, cant imagine a better place to be. Great weather. Very little snow. Beautiful country between the mtns and the sea. Fishin' ain't too bad either. Go Wolves!

Thanks guys. Super appreciate the insight.

 

[headduck]

Another question...go figure...

After reading a bit more about WF vs DT:

It appears that WF lines are most appropriate for my goals and the fast graphite?

The older rods, a double taper?

Does this jibe with your experience? Is it that simple...cant imagine it is but hope so.

The cortland peach says it's a freshwater line, but is there any reason it cant double for the salt? Is it color etc. rather than a difference in material that will lead to line failure. Just bank fishing stuff.

I'd like to be able to fish both woth same rig...for now anyway. The reel is a salt version.

 

[clarkman]

I do love those old Bronson's. They're not the toughest reels out there so be careful with it. Sounds like you're well on your way to getting things set up.

Regarding older rod/line combos: it's personal preference. A lot of old timers swear by DTs but I personally can't stand them and fish WF on all of my glass (both older and newer). I'm probably one of the few who also really likes shooting heads for my glass as well, but then again just a few target the tiger muskies I do and even fewer with glass. Point being, the way you start out doing it may not be the way you discover that you prefer in the long run.

Also, try not to sweat the little things...

 

[Matt B]

While the fly line companies would love for you to believe your FW line won’t work in saltwater, that isn’t true. The plastic line won’t disintegrate because of salt. It’s all those ferrous metals in anything else like hooks, reels, and line guides you have to think about, and rinse well.

 

[ARecher]

The bronson is a multi, but also have a single action 306 in it's original box sold for $3.95. I could see a silver or any larger fish detroying the multi. The W&M is more more a darker orange and super soft. Denco, I assumed that was a brand name but it's the blank material? Thanks for the schoolin.

I have 5-6 other rods from gpa that I'll start to use when I get a bit better. Dont want to ruin sentimental items. Although I'm not sure if they're worth babying or or even using.

Will look at larger backing spools and the cortland lines.

I know a bit about the fluidity of regs here... I've met our game warden a few times. She can often be found overlooking the hole with binoculars. She doesn't mess around and is quick with the pen. Especially if a few well know "flossers" are present.

I'll be on the hunt for a 5wt. My cousin used to guide in Bzmn MT and did time at a local fly shop there. If I can wait til i see him, he's got a little sumthin for me...as well as couple holes to show off. The waiting is the hardest part.

Yup Sequim. For me, cant imagine a better place to be. Great weather. Very little snow. Beautiful country between the mtns and the sea. Fishin' ain't too bad either. Go Wolves!

Thanks guys. Super appreciate the insight.

Cool. I try to get out and fish your local river a few times each fall. Mostly gear (spinners, beads, jigs)--being new to the fly rod. I haven't run across the warden yet but I've heard the flossers complaining. I try to avoid them if I can--fishing is usually better. I cleaned up so much trash this past season. I found a big double hook rig with probably 6/0 hooks and a big silver corky on probably 80 pound mono. If you ever want to try the beaches at Flagler or Point Wilson, feel free to send me a PM. I can describe the setup for cut plug herring. The fish aren't as concentrated in the salt but the quality of the meat is sooo much better IMO (if that's what you're after).

 

[Herkileez]

For fishing salmon species and up, I strongly recommend 30# backing...You want your weaker breaking point at the front end, not the back....nothing worse than losing your entire line to a heavy fish.
The Remix is a decent reel, with good drag...you're well on your way.

 

[clarkman]

Oh, don't use your Bronson in the salt.

 

[headduck]

Thanks guys.

@ARecher - I've come across those rigs...my favorite the "delicato" 4' hali rod, 80lb braid, 8/0 treble with weight stacked up the shank. I've seen a hole cleaned quick with rig. It's legal for some. I'll hit you up for Intel if I head out that way. Thank you.

@Herkileez - good point on the strength of backing.

@clarkman - appreciate the thoughts and I'll leave the Bronson off the salt and get fishing soon enough so I can understand what details matter for me most.

@Matt B - thanks I'll give a good rinse after the salt... all those little odds and ends sure add up

Appreciate your insight guys.

 

[ifsteve]

Like mentioned above a great way to go for backing is to buy a bulk spool of braid. I like 65#Jerry Brown but its pricey. I like 65# as still offers plenty of capacity but a little larger diameter for handling. As for cutting your fingers? It will only happen once then you will learn the correct way when a fish runs is to keep your fingers off the line.....lol