There was a previous post about M lake zombies.....and Eells sub par brooders. C&R and selective lakes deserve better quality fish!What's wrong with this hatchery. Trout that look like noses cut off for tags, ripped jaws, tumors.
Exactly! Not sure how many survive in that lilly algae lake, but why put in monstrosities to C&R. I don't think fish noses grow back.There was a previous post about M lake zombies.....and Eells sub par brooders. C&R and selective lakes deserve better quality fish!
Dang turtle face trout! Sure be nice if the gave us a nice CnR or slot limit to release unless under 16" lake where the fished survive and grow on their own. Then they could eventually close this hatchery or only dump fish in Elma. Ah, but this WA.Sure don’t seem to.
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There was a previous post about M lake zombies.....and Eells sub par brooders. C&R and selective lakes deserve better quality fish!
I think it comes down to budget and cost per fish. If WDFW/the state spent more on hatcheries, a lot of folks would crap themselves. It’s my understanding, please correct me if I’m wrong, that a lot of the nose and fin issues come from impacts with cement tank walls, and a lot more of the mutants survive in hatcheries due to lessened survival pressure (a hatchery is built around maximizing survival rates, while nature is built around the survival of the adequate).Instead of why put in such monstrosities, why raise such? The current acceptable standard at some hatcheries is poo poo.
I think it comes down to budget and cost per fish. If WDFW/the state spent more on hatcheries, a lot of folks would crap themselves. It’s my understanding, please correct me if I’m wrong, that a lot of the nose and fin issues come from impacts with cement tank walls, and a lot more of the mutants survive in hatcheries due to lessened survival pressure (a hatchery is built around maximizing survival rates, while nature is built around the survival of the adequate).
You could probably artificially replicate a trout river enough to raise beautiful fish, but the cost per fish would be astronomical.
The problem with quality lakes is….many just aren’t that quality anymore.
There is no way I’m driving 3 hours or so to fish some quality lakes just for the fishing alone and to catch 13-17” fish. That’s just me though.
Adding in some nice scenery may help but I probably still won’t get me to go.
I can catch the same or better quality fish in a few local put and take lakes that are an hour or so from my place.
The best lake fishing I’ve ever had in this state was the third year after a rehab on put and take lakes planted with fry.
SF
I worked a couple of years in a lab that worked with trout and salmon and even though we had nowhere near as many fish as a hatchery produces cleaning was no joke. It's all well and good to say that changing the raceway design would be helpful for the fish but when I think about the easiest design to maintain for the people who have to work with the fish every day, featureless and concrete makes a lot of sense. Anywhere that waste builds up has to be vacuumed/cleaned and dead fish have to be removed. Any extra pieces like liners if you are trying to manage tens of raceways would end up having a pretty large time cost to maintain and work around.I agree to cost but some are minute additions at the margin to a hatchery cost. One of the cheapest preventative measures I have seen is various liners. There is a two part liner system that does a good job removing impacts and installs inside raceways.
These raceways haven’t evolved for decades. 90 degree walls, no natural material and usually no liners. If you have no incentive to innovate, innovation is never achieved. You could go tops down even, install snap together protection that overlaps the tanks top and extends to the bottom. Think rubber flexible bird spikes 3” all over rubber walls to deter and soften impact by spreading load.
Of course it’ll have additional cost but not as much as completely redesigning raceways into circles (which do help). I am completely okay with a couple hours extra a week in labor for vastly healthier product.I worked a couple of years in a lab that worked with trout and salmon and even though we had nowhere near as many fish as a hatchery produces cleaning was no joke. It's all well and good to say that changing the raceway design would be helpful for the fish but when I think about the easiest design to maintain for the people who have to work with the fish every day, featureless and concrete makes a lot of sense. Anywhere that waste builds up has to be vacuumed/cleaned and dead fish have to be removed. Any extra pieces like liners if you are trying to manage tens of raceways would end up having a pretty large time cost to maintain and work around.
There are definitely other options though, after doing a google search it looks like circular tanks are working out for some hatcheries in Alaska.
I grew up in Thurston County, and the trout stocking strategy then consisted of a combination of spring "legal" stocker plants and Sept. fingerling plants. Those fingerling plants are what produced the quality trout. (An aside, I met a WDG worker when he was doing a fingerling plant, and he said they could stock the lake for $1.50. I think that was a gross under-estimate even back then, but it help makes the point about costs.) Fast forward to 1992 when I moved back to Thurston County and was looking for the lakes with fingerling plants. I was told that doesn't work well anymore because commorants, that used to forage in salt water, discovered the low land lakes and stocked trout. Damn cormmorants never used to be on the lakes, and a local neighbor made sure the merganser population stayed under control too. Trout fishing was pretty good. Lethal removal of the predators is no longer allowed, and neighbors will report you even if you're legally shooting at mallards in season. And residents on some lakes raise hell about rotenone use also, . . . and then complain about the lousy trout fishing.Hold over fish and fry planting are a good thing.
Makes sense, noticed a whole log full of those awful commorants. But I don't think they would eat Ells jumbos. I don't mind yokuls keeping stocker fish, this state will never go CnR or slot, but the simple solution to extend the season is lower limit. That's what they do to use in the fall for salmon.I grew up in Thurston County, and the trout stocking strategy then consisted of a combination of spring "legal" stocker plants and Sept. fingerling plants. Those fingerling plants are what produced the quality trout. (An aside, I met a WDG worker when he was doing a fingerling plant, and he said they could stock the lake for $1.50. I think that was a gross under-estimate even back then, but it help makes the point about costs.) Fast forward to 1992 when I moved back to Thurston County and was looking for the lakes with fingerling plants. I was told that doesn't work well anymore because commorants, that used to forage in salt water, discovered the low land lakes and stocked trout. Damn cormmorants never used to be on the lakes, and a local neighbor made sure the merganser population stayed under control too. Trout fishing was pretty good. Lethal removal of the predators is no longer allowed, and neighbors will report you even if you're legally shooting at mallards in season. And residents on some lakes raise hell about rotenone use also, . . . and then complain about the lousy trout fishing.